Fongo Mobile App Not Working Since Outage On April 27

[esfandiyar2000]

I and my wife both have Fongo mobile app with a number to make phone calls. Starting with massive outage happened on April 27 morning, we both had no Fongo mobile connection till May 1. After that day, till now May 12, we both have constant connection failure, meaning we make a phone call but either after few seconds, call drops, or the receiver cannot hear us. I am using Android phone and my wife is using iPhone. Both connected to Fido tablet data plan. Called the Fido and they told us Rogers, Telus, and Bell are no longer allowing VOIP services on their ends/lines and we should think of having a real cellphone plan. I have a cellphone plan with data on Fido, but Fongo mobile app doesn't work on that either. Seems we have no choice but to quit this service with that upcoming info and the fact that Fongo on their status page shows everything is up and running! Any thoughts?

[Liptonbrisk]

I and my wife both have Fongo mobile app with a number to make phone calls. Starting with massive outage happened on April 27 morning, we both had no Fongo mobile connection till May 1. After that day, till now May 12, we both have constant connection failure, meaning we make a phone call but either after few seconds, call drops, or the receiver cannot hear us.

Does the call drop at 32 seconds each and every time? If so, that's probably a SIP ALG issue.

Or are you getting choppy audio, and then the call drops? That's pretty typical with poor/intermittent internet connectivity (cellular signal strength matters).
Does this happen while to connected to Wi-Fi at home--or only while using Fido's cellular data? How strong is the cellular signal when this issue occurs? Are you outside or indoors?

This is easier for me to explain using Windows PC example because I have to look up free smartphone apps that are similar to WinMTR.


"Ping is a measurement of data packet transmission, and ping does affect delay or lag. All gamers know, almost inherently, that lag affects them negatively. A PC gamer will pound his or her keyboard in hope that a character will respond on his or her monitor, quickly, but when there's a delay or lag, reality doesn't meet expectation. A gamer can see this problem visually. Over VoIP, anything over 200-210 ms, you will typically start to encounter crosstalk due to increased delay, even if the untrained ear doesn't notice. All VoIP services are subject to the same scientific principles including the fact that speed of transmission affects delay. When pings (and especially) jitter are high, VoIP can be a pretty horrible experience . . . Anyone using any communication service (or even when playing online games or using other online services) should understand that the longer the path to the server being used, the greater the potential exists for a problem to occur somewhere along that path.

If you ever play an MMO or select an online game server, gamers almost always choose servers that are closest to them for the most responsive online gaming experience, for a very good reason.


Fongo Mobile's servers are in Southern Ontario and use SIP protocol.
For jitter, ping, and traceroutes, test to 208.85.216.36

Anything over 200ms is unacceptable. You'll begin to encounter crosstalk, even if an untrained ear doesn't notice. So, if you're getting really high pings and jitter, you have a problem.

What you don't want to see is 40, 45, 50, 35, 500, 40, 30, 45, 700. That's bad jitter.
You want relatively consistent pings without a lot of variation.

Bad jitter can produce broken up audio or choppiness during phone calls. Severe jitter/ping spikes can cause calls to drop and for incoming calls to not be received. Ping affects delay from the time someone speaks until the time it's heard."


There are smartphone apps, such as Net Analyzer, that allow users to run ping tests to IPs, which may be a better idea to try since the problem is on a smartphone (or tablet).

The difference, here, is that when you test on a PC, chances are you're not connecting to cellular data, unless you're using a smartphone as a Wi-Fi hotspot, which is necessary to help discover where the problem is if you're using cellular data when the problem occurs. The caveat is you may be incurring cellular data charges while testing or using up a limited cellular data pool while testing.


1.Use winmtr https://sourceforge.net/projects/winmtr//. Ping about 200 times.
When using WINMTR, look at the very last line or hop when checking your pings.

If you're on a Macintosh, maybe this helps: https://www.reddit.com/r/TagPro/comment ... tr_on_mac/

When using WinMTR, look at your average ping and then maximum ping. Although WinMTR doesn't provide a jitter value, you can get an idea of what yours is by subtracting maximum ping from your average.
Jitter is the difference between each successive ping.
The bigger the difference, the bigger the problem.

Same with ping, which represents lag or delay. The lower your ping and jitter, the better."


There are smartphone apps, such as Net Analyzer, that allow users to run ping tests to IPs, which would probably be a better idea since the problem is on a smartphone.


2. If you're connecting to Wi-Fi, ensure SIP ALG is disabled in the router being used.


Keep SIP ALG disabled.

To understand why SIP ALG often causes horrible problems, please visit
https://www.voip-info.org/routers-sip-alg/ (scroll down to the section on SIP ALG problems).

If you're dealing with a modem/router combo issued by an ISP or a router with SIP ALG forced on with no way to disable it, enable Alternate Fongo Connection in the Fongo Mobile app (see step 3 below).


Here are examples for disabling SIP ALG in gateways:


i) Hitron CGN3ACSMR and CODA-4582 series gateway modem/router combo from Rogers (and possibly other ISPs)


Open your web browser, and login at 192.168.0.1. Default username is cusadmin.
Select the “Basic” tab and disable “SIP ALG.” Click the “save changes” button.

ii) HItron CODA--4680 (possibly from Fizz and other ISPs)

Login at192.168.0.1.
Navigate to Basic Settings -->Gateway Function tab
Disable SIP ALG
Save Changes.


iii) Arris XB6 from Rogers

Open your web browser, and login at 10.0.0.1
Navigate to Advanced-->Options.
Uncheck the SIP box.
Click "Apply".


iv) SageMcom F@st3896 V2 from Cogeco

Open your web browser, and login at 192.168.0.1
Default username is "admin"
Password is located on the sticker on the back of the gateway.
Navigate to Access Control-->Advanced Options.
Turn off SIP ALG.
Click "Apply".

Be careful not to reset the F@st3896 gateway. Otherwise, SIP ALG will turn back on.

v) Technicolor XB7 from Rogers

Note that here isn't an option to disable SIP ALG in a (Technicolor CGM4331COM) XB7 (Gen 2) gateway with this Rogers firmware version:
eMTA & DOCSIS Software Version: Prod_21.1_d31 & Prod_21.1
Software Image Name: CGM4331COM_5.2p12s1_PROD_sey

According to a tier 2 rep at Rogers, SIP ALG is enabled by default in XB7 with no way to disable it.
I'm not sure whether that representative is correct (the part about SIP ALG being enabled). However, the response from Rogers seems to coincide with what's happening in Xfinity/Comcast XB7's in the U.S.: https://forums.xfinity.com/conversation ... 66f45f8df1. If you are experiencing issues with a Rogers XB7, try voip4.freephoneline.ca:6060 along with a high, random local SIP Port (X_UserAgentPort should be a random port number between 30000 and 60000 with Obihai ATAs and Obihai IP Phones, and SIP Port, found by navigating to Voice-->whatever Line you're using for FPL-->SIP settings, should be a random number between 30000 and 60000 when using a Linksys/Cisco ATA).

vi) XB8 (Gen 3) has just been released from Rogers

I have no information yet concerning whether SIP ALG can be disabled in the XB8.
A tier 2 rep mentioned that Rogers is moving towards locking out administration setting changes for users, so it's doubtful that SIP ALG can be disabled in the XB8, but we'll have to wait to confirm.
His reasoning is that if you can't disable SIP ALG in XB7, it's unlikely XB8 will offer the capacity to disable SIP ALG either.


Did I mention SIP ALG might cause problems? How about a security issue?

https://www.snbforums.com/threads/vulne ... ost-657216

The NAT Slipstream attack is the one that uses ALGs helpers to potentially compromise clients. I recommend making sure none of the settings on the NAT Passthrough page is set to "Enabled + NAT Helper", they should be either "Enabled" or "Disabled". I haven't tested this, but I would expect that ensuring NAT helpers are disabled to be enough to prevent this attack vector.

Those ALG are generally not needed by modern clients. For instance, I have both an ATA (for my home phone) and a direct IP phone (for work) here, both work fine without the need for an ALG helper.

Note that numerous browsers are now implementing mitigation methods by blocking certain ports used by these protocols.

RMerlin is the developer of Asuswrt-Merlin firmware. He is referring to settings in Merlin router firmware.

NAT slipstreaming involving ALGs, including SIP ALG, doesn't just apply to Asuswrt-Merlin, of course: https://samy.pl/slipstream/. It's a potential issue for everyone.


3. Using Fongo Mobile,
"in the side menu, tap Account
tap Settings
under the Troubleshooting section-->enable Alternate Fongo Connection."
https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/arti ... ngo-Mobile

Also, check to ensure "Allow IPv6 Connection" is enabled. It should be by default.

Called the Fido and they told us Rogers, Telus, and Bell are no longer allowing VOIP services on their ends/lines and we should think of having a real cellphone plan

I chuckled (not at you).


Fongo Wireless uses Rogers' cellular network: https://www.fongo.com/services/fongo-wireless/.
The intention is for Fongo Wireless customers to use Fongo Mobile (and/or Fongo Works).
Cellular signal strength and coverage matters when using cellular data: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/arti ... s-Coverage.
If Fongo Mobile didn't work on Rogers' cellular network it wouldn't make any sense for Fongo Wireless to use Rogers.

Telus Mobility's cellular data network works fine with Fongo Mobile as well, provided, of course, the user has a strong cellular signal.

In other words, I don't have any problems using Fongo Mobile where I am, currently, and I don't have issues at home while connected to Wi-Fi because of points B and C from viewtopic.php?f=8&t=20199#p78976. Far more importantly, my pings and jitter to the servers being used are low, and with cellular data, that can have everything to do with where I happen to be standing.

[Liptonbrisk]

By the way, support staff is not obligated to respond on these user-to-user support forums.
Volunteer moderators (including me) don't work for Fongo.

If you would like to pursue other suggestions from official support staff, submit a ticket: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new.

You can check your ticket status by logging in at https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests. That's an account for tickets (zendesk) only and is completely separate from your Freephoneline account. Use the same email address that you use to submit tickets. Do not use the same password. Again, the Zendesk account is completely separate from your Fongo Mobile account.

Support staff does not respond to tickets on weekends or holidays. Support hours are 9 a.m. until 4 p.m. EST.

Visit https://status.fongo.com/.
If "Support System" indicates "Degraded Performance", ticket response time can take up to a week.


Lastly, and I'm saying this as a non-Fongo employee with my own opinion, understanding the nature of SIP and communication services means that I have a backup in case one service or another goes down. I do not solely rely on one service.


Just having a mobility service alone doesn't mean 100% uptime either:
https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/8/23199 ... 911-canada
https://mobilesyrup.com/2023/01/16/bell ... -resolved/
https://mobilesyrup.com/2022/10/19/telu ... -home-b-c/

[esfandiyar2000]

Thank you for providing lengthy explanations. I appreciate that.
To answer your questions:
1) Does the call drop at 32 seconds each and every time?
I have not measured the exact timing of call drop, but I can say that on my Android phone, I have had a call drops within seconds, a call drops possibly within that 32 seconds, a call drops within very first few minutes of call. The same goes with my wife.
2) Or are you getting choppy audio, and then the call drops?
No, there is no choppy audio so far.
3) Does this happen while to connected to Wi-Fi at home--or only while using Fido's cellular data? How strong is the cellular signal when this issue occurs? Are you outside or indoors?
On Wi-Fi(Bell Fiber 1.5G), Fido tablet data plan, and Fido cellphone plan, that includes data, same goes and call drops on both my device and my wife's. When I use Fido cellphone plan itself to make a call, call never drops, never gets cut, and there is no quality issue, whatsoever. No matter if I am indoor or in the balcony, the same issue happens. Signal strength is showing LTE instead of H+. H+ normally happens when the signal strength drops and it switches back from LTE to H+ which is not the case here for us to happen, fortunately.

I called the Bell today and ask the rep to speak with technical department. They brought to my attention that Fongo VOIP service may have further interruptions due to the recent policy changes on third party VOIP apps support over data plans. Not sure what that means, but it could imply that Fongo phone app could face another rounds of frequent outage in foreseeable future. I will look into to your provided details to see if i can fix it myself, and I have opened a ticket few days back on Fongo technical support asking about this, but only general scripts and vague short statements I have received so far.

Again, I appreciate your dedicated time typing solutions in regards to my concern and i totally understand that this is not volunteer/your job to go through lengthy detailed response to provide solution for each and every Fongo user. For me, since I am not a technical guy, simplicity works. I have used Fongo for few years and I was quite happy with it, but after that massive outage occurred on April 26 and took to May first 2023, I was expecting to see the problem has been resolved till now which is May 12. Honestly speaking, until the day April 26 everything was quite OK and both I and my wife could use our Fongo mobile app on both Bell Fiber home internet connection and Fido data plan for tablets. But after that massive outage, the service has not been itself so far and we no longer could use it. We were in doubt in terms of what was happened since Fongo only sent a short message saying that they are sorry and further explanation will be provided, which didn't happen. Then I decided to call both Fido and Bell and found that it might be their end interfering with Fongo mobile app over VOIP services. Since Fongo didn't provide any explanation as to what was the cause and why it happened and they don't provide any solution to submitted ticket in support section, I believe we should slowly move on since this is a free of charge app and no complain should be made. The downside is reliability because right between April 26 till May first I was in another city under surgery operation and hospital admission and if it was not my Fido cell phone plan with data, text, and voice, I was not sure how to use my cellphone with only Fongo mobile app for my needs. Simply put, it happened when it was most needed.

[Liptonbrisk]

Th
1) Does the call drop at 32 seconds each and every time?
I have not measured the exact timing of call drop, but I can say that on my Android phone, I have had a call drops within seconds, a call drops possibly within that 32 seconds, a call drops within very first few minutes of call. The same goes with my wife.

If the dropped calls are related to SIP ALG being enabled on a router, gateway, or hub, I would expect call duration to be extremely precise and to always drop at approximately 32 seconds, for example, on every single call at the exact same time.

Does this happen while to connected to Wi-Fi at home--or only while using Fido's cellular data? How strong is the cellular signal when this issue occurs? Are you outside or indoors?
On Wi-Fi(Bell Fiber 1.5G), Fido tablet data plan, and Fido cellphone plan, that includes data, same goes and call drops on both my device and my wife's.

I would try the WinMTR test I mentioned earlier from a PC, if the problem is also happening while on Wi-Fi.

I called the Bell today and ask the rep to speak with technical department. They brought to my attention that Fongo VOIP service may have further interruptions due to the recent policy changes on third party VOIP apps support over data plans.

I'm skeptical that Bell is filtering or shaping SIP traffic on its network. I am amused that they immediately suggested you buy a mobility plan after making that comment.

Not sure what that means, but it could imply that Fongo phone app could face another rounds of frequent outage in foreseeable future.

The recent outage had nothing to do with ISPs.

I have used Fongo for few years and I was quite happy with it, but after that massive outage occurred on April 26 and took to May first 2023, I was expecting to see the problem has been resolved till now which is May 12.

Fongo Mobile's servers are up and running. During the outage, the servers were down.

the service has not been itself so far

I am not able to reproduce your issue. Also, I have extended family members who use Bell Fibe with Fongo Mobile. They don't have any problems using Fongo Mobile.

We were in doubt in terms of what was happened since Fongo only sent a short message saying that they are sorry and further explanation will be provided, which didn't happen.

On April 27th, Fongo sent an email with the subject heading "Server Outage Affecting Your Services". I received it.

They also posted the following on Twitter:
"We had a major failure with our core infrastructure that processes all of our voice traffic. To fix this we had to shutdown our servers and begin rebuilding our infrastructure. Since our servers had to be shutdown, all aspects of Fongo had to go offline, including dashboards, billing portals and even our main website."
https://twitter.com/Fongo_Support/statu ... 8250825734

Then I decided to call both Fido and Bell and found that it might be their end interfering with Fongo mobile app over VOIP services.

I'm very skeptical until that's either proven or published in writing somewhere. The amount of backlash from making comments concerning traffic shaping, filtering, and anti-competitive practices wouldn't be insignificant.

What could be happening is a problem at a hop (dropping packets) somewhere between you and Fongo's servers, in which case, WinMTR or a traceroute might help locate where the problem is occurring.

Since Fongo didn't provide any explanation as to what was the cause and why it happened

They did publish a FAQ, which they have since pulled down. Originally, it was located at http://fongo.com/faq-outage, but it's gone now.

You may wish to escalate your ticket to support manager: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/arti ... -complaint. If so, ask someone to take a look at a SIP trace of your call logs to see whether they can find anything that might explain the issue. Login at https://account.fongo.com/admin/reports/call-logs/. Select "current month", and click the "submit" button. Provide the full call log line (Date, from, to) in your ticket for each call where the issue occurred. Do the same for your wife (have her submit a ticket with the same information). Politely request that a support manager look at the SIP logs.


Anyway, I hope you're recovering well, after your surgery.