10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

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10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 06/07/2021

Monday June 7, 2021.

The Problem:
Freephoneline (FPL) desktop application version 3.2.7.0.
At the call destination residence after picking up the landline telephone receiver, there is a delay of approximately 10-15 seconds before the sound of voice (receiver and caller) is established. The time is visible on the FPL call duration timer.

The Setup:
The Freephoneline (FPL) desktop application is installed on two separate laptops, my old Toshiba with Windows 7 (F-Secure antivirus) and my new Dell with Windows 10 Update 21H1 (McAfee LiveSafe antivirus). A headset is alternately connected to the laptop to listen and speak. I’m using wireless through a D-Link DIR657 HD Media Router 1000 and both laptops have the same VPN connected to the Internet using Open VPN (UDP) protocol.

The Test:
I login to my FPL account and the desktop application displays the keypad to dial the telephone number. The long-distance number I dial, prefixed by the digit “1”, is my brother’s landline telephone in Ontario, Canada. I click on the “Call” button. I hear the FPL ringing chime in the headset and I wait for the sound of my brother’s voice to say “hello”.

Scenario 1 with laptop Windows 7:
Using the FPL on my Toshiba laptop with Windows 7, as soon as my brother hears his landline ringing, he lifts up the receiver and I immediately hear him say hello and he can hear my voice. The audio connection is established immediately and the FPL operates fine without any problems.

Scenario 2: with laptop Windows 10
Using the FPL on my Dell laptop with Windows 10 Update 21H1, after clicking on the FPL “Call” button, I hear the FPL ringing chime. Then it stops and I hear weird crackling noises of “glep, glep, glep and then no sound at all, just dead silence. Ultimately, my brother does confirm that his landline does ring and he does pick up the receiver but he cannot hear anything. I cannot hear him repeatedly saying hello, hello, hello and he can’t hear my voice saying are you there. There is dead silence on the line. There is no immediate audio connection established. Then after a delay of approximately 10-15 seconds, the audio connection is finally established and we can hear each other’s voices.

The Question:
Why does FPL work fine on the Toshiba laptop with Windows 7 but it doesn’t work properly on the Dell laptop with Windows 10?

What To Do:
It goes without saying that anybody picking up the receiver and only hearing dead silence is going to hang up in less than 10 seconds and so an audio connection would never be established.

I un-installed the FPL application, restarted my laptop and then re-installed the FPL application but the problem still exists.
I contacted Fongo using facebook messenger but without any success to fix the problem.
I contacted McAfee technical support and the agent suggested turning off the Firewall. I turned it off but the problem stills exists.
I un-installed the McAfee LifeSafe antivirus but the problem still exists.
I’m not comfortable changing settings on my new Dell laptop that I’m unfamiliar with out of fear of making things worse.

I see so many topics and wonder if my FPL problem has already been discussed and resolved. I tried using keywords to do a search but without any success in finding my problem.

I'm a newbie here and not proficient setting up laptop and Internet stuff.
If anybody can help me out, I’d really appreciate it.
Thank you.

regards,
Doug
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 06/07/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:Why does FPL work fine on the Toshiba laptop with Windows 7 but it doesn’t work properly on the Dell laptop with Windows 10?


Device drivers are likely different. I don't use the FPL desktop app unless I need to troubleshoot something, but I have FPL working fine on 3 different PCs running the latest official (not a preview or beta) version of Windows 10.

The first thing I would do is drop VPNs completely while testing. At bare minimum, you're just adding latency. You may feel you're protected, but you're only protecting one end of the call (once a call reaches the PSTN, it's unencrypted), and you're introducing potential problems. Yes, I appreciate you're running the same VPN on your older laptop, and the FPL desktop app works on it. That doesn't change what I'm saying. If the VPN is an app (instead of running on a router or dedicated device), I would uninstall the VPN, and reboot. Then test again. If the problem disappears, the issue involves the VPN. I would keep the VPN disabled during all tests.

Then I would connect using an ethernet cable directly to the new laptop from the modem (not your router). Test again. If the problem disappears, the problem involves your router/wi-fi and/or other devices on your LAN. Possibly enabling QoS for your newer laptop would help.

The third thing I would do is ensure FPL isn't running on any other device at the same time on your LAN.

The fourth thing I would do is see if there's updated audio drivers available for your new laptop.
And then I would run Latency Monitor for about an hour to see if it detects a problem, in particular while running the Freephoneline desktop app: https://www.resplendence.com/latencymon.
I don't know whether a bios update would help potential latency issues.





Given that your old laptop works, this may not help, but if your ISP issued you a modem/router combo, gateway, or hub, I would ensure it's in bridge mode. Contact your ISP for assistance.

D-Link DIR657


Login. Navigate to Firewall Settings-->Advanced-->Application Level Gateway (ALG) Configuration
Uncheck "SIP". Click "Save Settings". Keep SIP ALG disabled.

Reboot your laptop.
Run the FPL app and test.

The Freephoneline desktop app has been out of development, as far as I can determine, since February 23, 2013, and it's not officially supported (at least, not for free).
I am unable to not make it work, but I'm also not using the same hardware and drivers.

Other than what I've written, I have no further suggestions that I feel are worthwhile to pursue, unless you are able to get someone to instruct you on how to use Wireshark and is also willing to examine the captures for you.
It's possible port forwarding UDP 13000-13001 to the LAN IP of your new laptop might help (wild guess), which is for RTP (audio packets), but I fail to see why that would be necessary if audio eventually connects. It's not as though the NAT firewall is constantly causing a problem for the entire duration of calls. Keep in mind that port forwarding is a security risk.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 06/07/2021

June 7, 2021.

Thank you very much Liptonbrisk for all the technical information and troubleshooting suggestions. A lot of the technical stuff is way over my head but I shall read it over and over again and try out the suggestions methodically.

I do realize the FPL is now a "legacy" application.
I was informed however in my facebook chat that a Windows 10 version of FPL is to be released sometime in the future but no firm date is set. I have to take what I was told at face value though.

I will say this though, when I do get this glitch all figured out and eliminated, you'll be the first to know.

Thanks again for the help. Very much appreciated. Take care.

regards,
Doug
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 06/07/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:I was informed however in my facebook chat that a Windows 10 version of FPL is to be released sometime in the future


Wow, I had no idea. I thought development was dead. Thanks for mentioning that.


I will say this though, when I do get this glitch all figured out and eliminated, you'll be the first to know.


Sorry, I wish I had better suggestions for you. You might want to check for a potential bios update, but sometimes they can cause more problems.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 06/08/2021

Liptonbrisk, the following are messages from my chat on Fongo Facebook May 21, 2021.

FONGO: https://www.freephoneline.ca/

ME: Are you able to tell me if this application is going to be terminated by Fongo down the road?

FONGO: The program availability may wind down in about 1.5 years. We are working on a Fongo Desktop App for Windows 10 as a replacement.

ME: So when the time comes, I presume you will place an alert notice in the above website link you provided to announce the termination and to announce the release of the new Windows 10 version application.

FONGO: Correct!

regards,
Doug
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 06/08/2021

Thank you.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 07/01/2021

Hello again Liptonbrisk

I don't know how to use the "quote" feature but I'll give it a try and see what happens. I'll highlight it in Bold font.
You wrote this:


Device drivers are likely different. I don't use the FPL desktop app unless I need to troubleshoot something, but I have FPL working fine on 3 different PCs running the latest official (not a preview or beta) version of Windows 10.



I'm attempting to use a process of elimination to resolve my problem, one small step at a time.

1. Are you running the latest Windows 10 update 21H1 on all 3 of your PCs?

2. Are you running the FPL desktop application version 3.2.7 on all 3 of your PCs?

3. Did you have to make any changes to any settings on any of your hardware devices such as your router or PCs to make the FPL work?

4. Are all of your 3 PCs operating in wireless mode to the Internet?

With my Toshiba Windows 7, as soon as the FPL app was installed and I rebooted the Toshiba, the FPL worked fine. I didn’t need to make any changes to settings on my Toshiba that was directly connected to my ISP’s modem with an ethernet cable. Later on, I switched the Toshiba to wireless and the FPL worked fine. Problems only started when I got my Dell with Windows 10.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 07/01/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:
1. Are you running the latest Windows 10 update 21H1 on all 3 of your PCs?


Yes
Windows 10 Pro version 21H1 (OS Build 19043.1055)

There's a preview update available, and Windows 11 is coming out (available now for Windows Insiders) soon.
But I'm not bothering with those right now. I don't beta test OSes.

When Microsoft Patch Tuesday rolls around, I will update Windows 10 again on all PCs.



2. Are you running the FPL desktop application version 3.2.7 on all 3 of your PCs?


Yes


The Freephoneline desktop app has been out of development since February 23, 2013. The app version has not changed in over 8 years.

I am using Java 32 bit edition Version 8 Update 291. The Freephoneline desktop app requires the 32 bit edition of Java.

3. Did you have to make any changes to any settings on any of your hardware devices such as your router or PCs to make the FPL work?


Nothing other than what is described here: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=20199#p78976.
Other than QoS, what's described will not affect delayed audio.

Are all of your 3 PCs operating in wireless mode to the Internet?


Yes, and it makes no difference whether I'm connected via ethernet. However, using ethernet cable is less likely to introduce potential issues, which is why I mentioned #2 before.

Again. . ..

1) the first thing I would do is drop VPNs completely while testing. I would uninstall the VPN, and reboot. Then test again. If the problem disappears, the issue involves the VPN. I would keep the VPN disabled during all tests.

2) Then I would connect using an ethernet cable directly to the new laptop from the modem supplied by your ISP (not your router). Test again. If the problem disappears, the problem involves your router/wi-fi and/or other devices on your LAN. Possibly enabling QoS for your newer laptop would help.

3) The third thing I would do is ensure FPL isn't running on any other device at the same time on your LAN.

4)I would see if there's updated audio (and wi-fi) drivers available for your new laptop.


5) And then I would run Latency Monitor for about an hour to see if it detects a problem, in particular while running the Freephoneline desktop app: https://www.resplendence.com/latencymon.

I don't know whether a bios update for your laptop would help potential latency issues.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby bridonca » 07/02/2021

It would interesting to see if the Fongo Desktop App for Windows 10 is actually an Android app for Windows 11, assuming Windows 11 is supposed to be able to run Android coded apps.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 07/02/2021

Hello Liptonbrisk

Thanks for your response. I really appreciate your help and expertise as well as your patience.

The VPN scenario was to be next on my to-do-list to see if that eliminated my problem. First, I just wanted to find out your setup so that I have a common benchmark. Keep in mind, I’m not a computer expert, more of a work in progress novice.

You’re using Windows 10 Pro and I’m using Windows 10 Home. I wouldn’t think that would make any difference though. Today I did the “winver” command to see what version of Windows 10 I have on my Dell. It shows Version 21H1 (OS Build 19043.1055).

My Dell has the latest BIOS version.

I subscribe to Cnet and recently received an article about the release of Windows 11 so I’m hoping I can keep up to date with info received from Cnet.

You mention something called “Microsoft Patch Tuesday” concerning updates. What is it and where do I find it?

I believe the folks at Dell set up my laptop to update automatically. In fact, after I had downloaded version 21H1 (OS Build 19043.985) May 19, 2021, I did that “winver” today and saw that my Dell had been updated to 21H1 (OS Build 19043.1055) without me having to do it. So that confirms to me that my Dell gets updated automatically.

I am using Java 32-bit Version 8 Update 291.

Thanks for that link. A lot of technical information there for me to read and perhaps a lot is way over my head insofar as understanding what is being said and that’s my problem because I’m not a computer wiz. Is there such a thing as “FPL for Dummies”?

I concur in that it would make no difference going wireless or ethernet cable. My preference is to go with ethernet cable and not wireless.

As I had mentioned before, my Dell has no LAN port. I am using a Dell D6000 Dock that is connected to one of the Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) ports on my Dell. From that D6000 Dock, I have an ethernet cable going over to one of the ports on my D-Link DIR657 Router. The D-Link router has an ethernet cable going over to my ISP’s modem out to the Internet world. That’s my current setup now. When I originally connected all the ethernet cables, it didn’t work the first time. I had to run the troubleshoot which detected an error . . . “Ethernet 3 doesn’t have a valid IP configuration”.

When I looked at the Network Connections display on my Dell, that Ethernet 3 has a label identifying my D-Link router wireless network “name” and also a label that says “Dell Giga Ethernet” which I have to presume means the Dell D6000 Dock.

I didn’t understand the error and so I did some google research and found a solution that said I needed to configure the MAC address on the D6000 Dock. I also read something about DHCP lease renewal. I’m guessing that every time my router powers up (it’s turned off overnight at the power bar), an IP address is assigned to my D6000 Dock but I’m just guessing. I’m guessing my D-Link router gets the IP address from somewhere on the Internet but again, I don’t know. I do know the “lease” expires every 24 hours.

I did try to go directly from the LAN port on the D6000 Dock over to the LAN port on the ISP’s modem but it didn’t work. I got that same error message when I ran the troubleshoot . . . “Ethernet 3 doesn’t have a valid IP configuration”. Since I’m not using the D-Link router in this particular setup, I’m guessing there’s no way from the D6000 Dock to obtain an IP address but again, I’m just guessing and don’t know. I guess my ISP modem is incapable of obtaining an IP address. Maybe the VPN is interfering is this particular setup. I would have thought my ISP would provide that IP address to the Dell D6000 considering I have its MAC address configured correctly so it can be detected.

My old Toshiba is turned off but when it’s on, it connects wireless to the D-Link router. My preference is to use ethernet directly from that D6000 Dock over to my ISP modem (without any router) just the way it was with my old Toshiba.

Once I get FPL to work properly on my Dell, the plan is to update my Toshiba to Windows 10 but I can’t do that right now because it’s the Toshiba I use to operate FPL until I get it to work on my Dell. According to Cnet, you can still upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 10 for free but I’d have to see for myself when the time comes. My intention is to use only my Dell. The Toshiba would not be used and just be a standby PC.

My Dell is the only PC in use here so there are not multiple PCs running here on a wireless network, aside from my old Toshiba which right now is shutdown.

Thanks for the 5 suggestions at the end of your post. Enabling the QoS seems like an easy fast test. It’s something I can easily reset if the same FPL problem exists. I’ll try that first and see what happens. Then I’ll proceed with uninstalling my Surfshark VPN program and try the FPL again.

Regards,
Doug
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 07/02/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:. I really appreciate your help and expertise as well as your patience.


You're welcome.


You’re using Windows 10 Pro and I’m using Windows 10 Home. I wouldn’t think that would make any difference though.


It doesn't. The version of Windows 10 doesn't matter either. I've been using Windows 10 since launch, and the Freephoneline desktop app has always worked.
I feel the Java version used is more important, but attempting to resolve an initial audio lag call problem based on Java and Windows 10 versions is, I believe, misguided.

An RTP (audio stream) connection lag could be due to jitter or a ping spike. In that case, QoS might be important. But I wouldn't expect a ping spike to occur at the beginning of every single call. That would be too coincidental.

A firewall NAT association may be taking awhile to be established, which is why I would not test with a VPN.

If Wi-Fi is being used, interference or a wireless router setting could be an issue, but you say you're using an ethernet cable.

Since a PC is being used, an audio driver could be an issue.

Another driver could also be causing a latency issue, but I would expect the problem to occur intermittently and not just at the beginning of the call if that were the case.
Then again, the issue could be triggered by another driver when the call is first established.

I subscribe to Cnet and recently received an article about the release of Windows 11 so I’m hoping I can keep up to date with info received from Cnet.


https://www.techadvisor.com/buying-advi ... 1-3806086/

I guess Microsoft is updating its PC Health check app. It was available a few weeks ago.
Anyway, when it becomes available again, you can run it to see whether your computers can run Windows 11: https://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/windows/windows-11 (scroll down to the "Check for Compatibility" section).


You mention something called “Microsoft Patch Tuesday” concerning updates. What is it and where do I find it?


The second Tuesday of every month is Microsoft Patch Tuesday. That's when Microsoft releases Windows Updates.
Sometimes the 4th Tuesday of every month also includes updates that aren't security patches. Anyway, the second Tuesday of every month is the Tuesday to watch out for.
When you run Windows Update after 1 p.m. on the second Tuesday of July (July 13, 2021), you'll see updates available.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/in ... h-tuesday/


I concur in that it would make no difference going wireless or ethernet cable.


That's not what I meant. Wi-Fi for VoIP is less reliable than using an ethernet cable. However, in my environment, FPL works well on my my PCs, regardless.

I’m guessing that every time my router powers up (it’s turned off overnight at the power bar), an IP address is assigned to my D6000 Dock


A WAN IP lease from your ISP's modem is obtained by your D-LINK router, which provides LAN IPs to devices connected to it.

I did try to go directly from the LAN port on the D6000 Dock over to the LAN port on the ISP’s modem but it didn’t work.


The MAC address of the device connected to your modem changed when you disconnected your D-LINK router from the modem and attached the D6000 Dock. Each device has its own MAC address. Some ISP's modems will only provide a WAN IP lease to one device, and the modem will retain the MAC address info from the original device that was connected (and continue to only provide a WAN IP lease for that original device based on its MAC address). Try unplugging the modem for about 5 minutes after connecting a new device (your laptop, in this case) directly to the modem. Then plug power back in. Wait for modem to be fully up and running. Reboot computer. Then test.

Remember to power cycle the modem (unplug power, wait, plug in power) after connecting your DLink router again. You may need to reboot your D-Link router afterwards.


Proper device boot order is always
1. Modem-->2. Router-->3. Audio device (computer, ATA, IP Phone)
Make sure the first device has fully booted up before turning on the next one.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 07/02/2021

Hello Liptonbrisk

This is my feedback to those 5 tasks You suggested I do.
I did a copy/paste and my feedback is in red BOLD font.

1) the first thing I would do is drop VPNs completely while testing. I would uninstall the VPN, and reboot. I uninstalled all Surfshark VPN programs. Then test again. Problem not resolved. If the problem disappears, the issue involves the VPN. I would keep the VPN disabled during all tests.

2) Then I would connect using an ethernet cable directly to the new laptop from the modem supplied by your ISP (not your router). There is no LAN port on the laptop to connect to. That’s why I’m using the Dell D6000 Dock. No Internet Access established. Troubleshoot error “Ethernet doesn’t have a valid IP configuration”. The Cogeco DHCP Server is not assigning an IP address to the Giga ethernet card inside the Dell D6000 Dock. Test again. If the problem disappears, the problem involves your router/wi-fi and/or other devices on your LAN. Possibly enabling QoS for your newer laptop would help. QoS (Quality of Service Packet Scheduler) was already enabled.

3) The third thing I would do is ensure FPL isn't running on any other device at the same time on your LAN. The only other device is my old Toshiba and the Task Manager on it indicates the FPL is not running on the Toshiba.

4)I would see if there's updated audio (and wi-fi) drivers available for your new laptop. According to the device properties dialog box, the headphones audio driver is up to date. There is no updated driver available because the “update driver” button is not active (dimmed). The audio works fine after that 10-15 second delay expires. The Wi-Fi, I need to check further but then again the laptop is using ethernet connection, not Wi-Fi.

5) And then I would run Latency Monitor for about an hour to see if it detects a problem, in particular while running the Freephoneline desktop app: https://www.resplendence.com/latencymon. I have to read the Latency Monitor to understand it and to learn how to make it work.

I don't know whether a bios update for your laptop would help potential latency issues. I have the latest BIOS installed.

Sorry about the bad choice of me choosing red.
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Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 07/02/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:There is no LAN port on the laptop to connect to.


The point is to connect via ethernet cable.

The Cogeco DHCP Server is not assigning an IP address to the Giga ethernet card inside the Dell D6000 Dock.


The MAC address of the device connected to your modem changed when you disconnected your D-LINK router from the modem and attached the D6000 Dock. Each device has its own MAC address. Some ISP's modems will only provide a WAN IP lease for one device, and the modem will retain the MAC address info from the original (D-Link router, in this case) device that was connected (and continue to only provide an IP lease for that original device based on its MAC address). Try unplugging the modem for about 5 minutes after connecting a new device (D6000/laptop, in this case) directly to the modem. Then plug power back in. Wait for modem to be fully up and running. Reboot computer. Then test. A competent representative from your ISP should be able to assist you with this, especially considering most representatives I've encountered complain when a customer's router is involved during troubleshooting. They typically want the customer's modem connected directly to a computer when troubleshooting.


According to the device properties dialog box, the headphones audio driver is up to date.


That's not the most reliable way to determine whether it is. Visit the hardware audio device's (Realtek, for example) website, and see if a driver update is available. Then compare against the driver version number already installed on your computer.

You can also try contacting Dell: https://www.dell.com/support/home/en-ca?app=drivers. I usually find that Dell's driver listing lags behind what's actually available.

There is no updated driver available because the “update driver” button is not active (dimmed)


If that's greyed out in Device Manager using an administrator account in Windows, that's not normal. There is no device in Device Manager that has the "update driver" option greyed out on my PCs.

Also, the "update driver" option in Device Manager should always be available when running an administrator account, regardless of whether you're using the latest driver version.

I suggest creating a system restore point before changing drivers, and I will not be held responsible for any issue that you may encounter as a result of attempting to make changes.
You may wish to ask a knowledgeable friend for assistance.

Anyway, beyond what I've already suggested, I have no further ideas.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Liptonbrisk
Technical Support
 
Posts: 2661
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SIP Device Name: Obihai 202/2182, Groundwire
Firmware Version: various
ISP Name: gateway/hub in bridge mode
Computer OS: Windows 64 bit
Router: Asuswrt-Merlin & others

Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 07/03/2021

Hello Liptonbrisk

My old Toshiba (Windows 7) was powered down. Implementing your advice below, this morning I succeeded in establishing a connection to the Internet using the ethernet cable from my Dell D6000 Dock LAN port over to the LAN port on my ISP modem. Sure enough as you described below, my ISP has automatically provided a new IP address lease to my Dell D6000 Dock containing the Giga Ethernet card inside. So that Internet operation using the ethernet cable works fine now.

I decided to try the Freephoneline again on the Dell laptop. Unfortunately, the problem still persists.

The next thing I did was shutdown the Dell laptop/D6000 Dock and power down the ISP modem. I then rearranged the ethernet cables to get the unpowered D-Link router installed. Once that was done, I powered up the ISP modem and waited until it was finished its startup routine. Then I powered up the D-Link router and waited for it to finish its startup routine. Finally, I powered up the Dell laptop. The Dell is still showing that little ethernet icon on the task bar at the far right indicating it's connected to the Internet via ethernet cable (to the D-Link router) and not wireless. Then I powered up the old Toshiba in wireless mode. I succeeded to connect the Toshiba to the Internet wirelessly via the D-Link router.

Mission accomplished.

Now I need to further troubleshoot the Freephoneline.
I'm thinking I might have to do a clean fresh install of Windows 10 on the Dell laptop because there seems to be a lot of "Dell" stuff that got installed by Dell before I took delivery of it. Maybe some of that "stuff" is causing the FPL problem. I had purchased it online directly from Dell this past March. I have my Product Key (Digital License) and I already made a bootable flash drive with Windows 10 on it. More than likely I'll hold off until my 1 year warranty expires.

Thanks again for all your help, much appreciated.
I have more reading and tests to do.


[quoteThe MAC address of the device connected to your modem changed when you disconnected your D-LINK router from the modem and attached the D6000 Dock. Each device has its own MAC address. Some ISP's modems will only provide a WAN IP lease to one device, and the modem will retain the MAC address info from the original device that was connected (and continue to only provide a WAN IP lease for that original device based on its MAC address). Try unplugging the modem for about 5 minutes after connecting a new device (your laptop, in this case) directly to the modem. Then plug power back in. Wait for modem to be fully up and running. Reboot computer. Then test.
Remember to power cycle the modem (unplug power, wait, plug in power) after connecting your DLink router again. You may need to reboot your D-Link router afterwards.
Proper device boot order is always
1. Modem-->2. Router-->3. Audio device (computer, ATA, IP Phone)
Make sure the first device has fully booted up before turning on the next one.

The MAC address of the device connected to your modem changed when you disconnected your D-LINK router from the modem and attached the D6000 Dock. Each device has its own MAC address. Some ISP's modems will only provide a WAN IP lease for one device, and the modem will retain the MAC address info from the original (D-Link router, in this case) device that was connected (and continue to only provide an IP lease for that original device based on its MAC address). Try unplugging the modem for about 5 minutes after connecting a new device (D6000/laptop, in this case) directly to the modem. Then plug power back in. Wait for modem to be fully up and running. Reboot computer. Then test. A competent representative from your ISP should be able to assist you with this, especially considering most representatives I've encountered complain when a customer's router is involved during troubleshooting. They typically want the customer's modem connected directly to a computer when troubleshooting.
][/quote]
AlsatianMan
Just Passing Thru
 
Posts: 9
Joined: 06/04/2021
Firmware Version: Dell Inc BIOS v1.7.1
ISP Name: Cable
Computer OS: Windows 10 Home 21H1 Build 19043.1110
Router: Ethernet cable to ISP Modem

Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 07/03/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:Hello Liptonbrisk


If you want to use quotes, the syntax is
Code: Select all
[quote="usernameofpersonbeingquoted"]quoted text [/quote]

or

[quote] quoted text [/quote]



By the way, running latency monitor is as simple as downloading it, installing it, and executing the file: https://www.resplendence.com/download/LatencyMon.exe.
Then click the green play button.

Other than what I mentioned before I have no further suggestions.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
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Liptonbrisk
Technical Support
 
Posts: 2661
Joined: 04/26/2010
SIP Device Name: Obihai 202/2182, Groundwire
Firmware Version: various
ISP Name: gateway/hub in bridge mode
Computer OS: Windows 64 bit
Router: Asuswrt-Merlin & others

Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 07/07/2021

Liptonbrisk wrote:
The second Tuesday of every month is Microsoft Patch Tuesday. That's when Microsoft releases Windows Updates.
Sometimes the 4th Tuesday of every month also includes updates that aren't security patches. Anyway, the second Tuesday of every month is the Tuesday to watch out for.
When you run Windows Update after 1 p.m. on the second Tuesday of July (July 13, 2021), you'll see updates available.

https://www.techrepublic.com/article/in ... h-tuesday/

.



Well, there was an emergency patch issued yesterday: https://thehackernews.com/2021/07/micro ... h-for.html.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
User avatar
Liptonbrisk
Technical Support
 
Posts: 2661
Joined: 04/26/2010
SIP Device Name: Obihai 202/2182, Groundwire
Firmware Version: various
ISP Name: gateway/hub in bridge mode
Computer OS: Windows 64 bit
Router: Asuswrt-Merlin & others

Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 07/07/2021

Thanks Liptonbrisk for the "heads up" alert.
I will check it out and in the meantime, I've created a short cut to TheHackerNews for future reference.
AlsatianMan
Just Passing Thru
 
Posts: 9
Joined: 06/04/2021
Firmware Version: Dell Inc BIOS v1.7.1
ISP Name: Cable
Computer OS: Windows 10 Home 21H1 Build 19043.1110
Router: Ethernet cable to ISP Modem

Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby AlsatianMan » 07/13/2021

Tuesday July 13, 2021.

Hello Liptonbrisk

I finally made some time here to download and run the Latency Monitor today. I ran it with the VPN app turned off and the Freephoneline app running in the task bar. I ran it for 90 minutes.

I made screen captures of everything the report produced for MAIN, STATS, PROCESSES, DRIVERS, and CPUs.
It seems there's no option in here to insert or copy/paste JPG files in here. If there is, I can't find it.

This is all hi-tech stuff for me and from what I briefly read, it's a lot of technical information that is beyond my computer literacy skills and knowledge. I really don't know where to begin to troubleshoot. Perhaps as you suggested, the place to start is with "drivers".

I haven't read through all the various "conclusions" and the MAIN conclusion is this.

Your system appears to be having trouble handling real-time audio and other tasks. You are likely to experience buffer underruns appearing as drop outs, clicks or pops. One or more DPC routines that belong to a driver running in your system appear to be executing for too long. Also one or more ISR routines that belong to a driver running in your system appear to be executing for too long. One problem may be related to power management, disable CPU throttling settings in Control Panel and BIOS setup. Check for BIOS updates.
LatencyMon has been analyzing your system for 1:30:01 (h:mm:ss) on all processors.


regards,
Doug
AlsatianMan
Just Passing Thru
 
Posts: 9
Joined: 06/04/2021
Firmware Version: Dell Inc BIOS v1.7.1
ISP Name: Cable
Computer OS: Windows 10 Home 21H1 Build 19043.1110
Router: Ethernet cable to ISP Modem

Re: 10-15 Seconds Delay to Establish Audio Connection

Postby Liptonbrisk » 07/13/2021

AlsatianMan wrote:It seems there's no option in here to insert or copy/paste JPG files in here. If there is, I can't find it.


In LatencyMon, you can select "Edit"-->"copy report text to clipboard", and paste that information from LatencyMon here in a reply.

I have the option to upload attachments, but I have a moderator account. I'm not going to create a regular user account to see whether the option exists for regular user accounts.
You can check when you reply to a forum post by selecting "full editor" mode (instead of "quick reply") and then selecting the "upload attachment" tab.

Alternatively, you can upload images to imgur: https://imgur.com/upload.
And then you would use the following on these forums:
Code: Select all
[img]https://i.imgur.com/yourpic.jpeg[/img]





But please note that at this point there's really not much more I can do for you that I feel comfortable suggesting.
If you provide information, I can make suggestions, but they may involve updating or switching drivers (and sometimes switching them can cause other problems if the drivers are buggy) or changing settings that Dell doesn't want you to change. The last thing I want to do is start recommending disabling sleep settings and changing power settings only to have some Dell rep claim everything is my fault.

In some cases, there have been known latency issues with computers that were later addressed in bios updates that didn't exist at the time of the initial problem. Sometimes updating chipset drivers helps.
Before making any changes, I suggest creating a system restore point in Windows.


The things to look at in LatencyMon are reported hard page faults and the drivers associated with the highest DPC and ISR routine execution times. That information can provide hints for what is causing problems.

If you want very general troubleshooting info, visit https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/ar ... cy-issues/. I would not go through the optimization guides or anything else, and any changes you make are your responsibility.

I suggest posting at https://www.dell.ca/community/Laptops/ct-p/Laptops
Perhaps other users will have specific suggestions for you.
For example, visit https://www.dell.ca/community/Latitude/ ... -p/7732125 and https://www.dell.ca/community/XPS/DPC-L ... -p/7578528

Some laptops exhibit this problem more than others: https://www.notebookcheck.net/DPC-Laten ... 376.0.html (useful chart).

Ultimately, Dell reps are being paid to offer support, and they are supposed to provide support to you. LatencyMon is providing evidence of an issue.
I can't guarantee that issue is causing your problem with FPL's desktop app, but that seems like a reasonable place to start.
Please do not send me emails; I do not work for nor represent Freephoneline or Fongo. Post questions on the forums so that others may learn from responses or assist you. Thank you. If you have an issue with your account or have a billing issue, submit a ticket here: https://support.fongo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new. Visit http://status.fongo.com/ to check FPL/Fongo service status. Freephoneline setup guides can be found at viewforum.php?f=15.
User avatar
Liptonbrisk
Technical Support
 
Posts: 2661
Joined: 04/26/2010
SIP Device Name: Obihai 202/2182, Groundwire
Firmware Version: various
ISP Name: gateway/hub in bridge mode
Computer OS: Windows 64 bit
Router: Asuswrt-Merlin & others


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