SUGGESTION: Cities for new DIDs

[TheHardy]

Starting a thread for suggestions, to make it easier for Fongo/DV/FPL to see where the customer demand is ...

Seeing as I am a BC-boy, I would kick this off by asking that serious consideration be given to making DIDs available in:
VICTORIA, BC
ABBOTSFORD, BC

Both of these already have FREE calling via Fongo/DV/FPL, but having assignable #'s here would be nice.

I also notice that there are 2 new NPA-NXX's pending for VANCOUVER numbers by Fibernetics ...
778-775 & 778-776

I am going to guess (educated, but just a guess), that utilization of the BC NON-Vancouver DID's is low (they are Richmond, New Westminster, North Vancouver and West Vancouver -- all in METRO VANCOUVER and all sharing the same LCA anyways!). While all numbers in the Metro-Vancouver area are supposed to be PORTABLE within their own region as well (as they all have EXACTLY the same LCA, even though they have different rate-centre names), if Fibernetics is looking to cover population and offer rate-centres as options, I would STRONGLY urge them to consider a WHALLEY rate-centre (rather than another VANCOUVER one) as that area is a HIGH POPULATION GROWTH and may facilitate more PORT INS.

To Fibernetics staff also, it MAY be beneficial to request 604-based NPA-NXXs if at all possible for immediate future expansion in the Metro-Vancouver area as it is the OLDER more established NPA in the region (as opposed to 778, which was the concentrated OVERLAY NPA); there are still a fair number of 604 NXX's available, although IRISTEL, ISP TELECOM and DISTRIBUTEL are "gobbling" up exchanges at a very high rate! Just some local on-the-ground knowledge.

[j8van]

In VoIP industry, Ontario and Quebec are undoubtly the very well developed regions, and when compared with these two giants, BC, as well as the rest of Canada, are likely "the Third World"...

[TheHardy]

In VoIP industry, Ontario and Quebec are undoubtly the very well developed regions, and when compared with these two giants, BC, as well as the rest of Canada, are likely "the Third World"...

That may well be, based on where the majority of the population is. But look at the usage statistics and who has adopted the technology. There is a lot of activity in the west, due mainly to the robust economy.

While these may not be motivating factors directly to Fongo/FPL/DV, they cannot be discounted entirely either.

Population growth forecasts cannot be completely ignored, nor can internal migration and immigration stats either. Breaking out demographics and socio-economic data paints a more complete overall picture and may allow those that make the "Big Money decisions from their Ivory Towers" to get ahead of the cutting edge and be on the bleeding edge ...

[apukwa]

Peterborough, ON would be great.

[TheHardy]

Peterborough, ON would be great.

I would be more happy to see it make the FREE CALLING list first, as it does not seem to have even THAT status yet.

The cities I listed above, are at least, on the FREE CALLING list. Which would therefore make them slightly more likely to get a DID before Peterborough.

And even though it has a pop of what? About 95000, it may not rank high enough to get attention from Fongo. I hope it does tho, as it would be nice to at least get free calling INTO the Pete, even if not a DID from it quite yet!

There's always hope, and Fongo does keep claiming that they are ever expanding!

[TheHardy]

as an FYI post, the following NPA-NXX's are considered Peterborough ...

[705] 201 243 270 304 312 313 403 536 559 740 741 742 743 745 748 749 750 755 760 761 768 772 775 808 813 868 872 874 875 876 926 927 930 931 933 957 977 991

[TheHardy]

Scanning the CNAC website, I see that Fibernetics has requested and been granted some more prefixes for BC ... unfortunately none of them are in NEW ratecentres, simply additional numbers for ratecentres that Fibernetics already has a presence in.

As noted previously:
778-775 & 778-776 -- Vancouver (adds to 604-283 & 778-300)
778-308 -- Richmond (adds to 778-803)
778-358 -- New Westminster (adds to 778-801)
778-382 -- North Vancouver (adds to 778-802)
778-508 -- West Vancouver (adds to 778-805)

Now I know that Fibernetics is "back-east" based (not "out-east" or "down-east"), but they are missing out on a large part of the population in Metro Vancouver. While it may seem like North & West Vancouver are part of Vancouver, they are actually separated by a large body of water and bridges, and are quite separate and distinct.

Here are some population facts (original link: http://www.metrovancouver.org/about/pub ... Trends.pdf)

Vancouver City -- 603,502 (VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Surrey -- 468,251 (WHALLEY, NEWTON, CLOVERDALE and some LANGLEY, FORT LANGLEY ratecentres)
Burnaby -- 223,218 (VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Richmond -- 190,473 (RICHMOND and some NEW WESTMINSTER ratecentre)
Coquitlam -- 126,456 (PORT COQUITLAM, PORT MOODY and some VANCOUVER, NEW WESTMINSTER ratecentres)
Delta -- 99,863 (LADNER, NEWTON, WHALLEY ratecentres)
Langley Township -- 104,177 (LANGLEY, FORT LANGLEY and some ALDERGROVE ratecentres)
North Vancouver Dist -- 84,412 (NORTH VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Maple Ridge -- 76,052 (HANEY ratecentre)
New Westminster -- 65,976 (NEW WESTMINSTER and some VANCOUVER ratecentres)
Port Coquitlam -- 56,342 (PORT COQUITLAM ratecentre)
North Vancouver City -- 48,196 (NORTH VANCOUVER ratecentre)
West Vancouver -- 42,694 (WEST VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Port Moody -- 32,975 (PORT MOODY, PORT COQUITLAM ratecentres)
Langley City -- 25,081 (LANGLEY ratecentre)
White Rock -- 19,339 (WHITE ROCK, NEWTON ratecentres)
Pitt Meadows -- 17,736 (HANEY ratecentre)
UBC/UEL Electoral Area 'A' -- 13,035 (VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Indian Reserves -- 8,094 (various ratecentres)
Bowen Island -- 3,402 (BOWEN ISLAND ratecentre)
Anmore -- 2,092 (PORT MOODY ratecentre)
Lions Bay -- 1,318 (WEST VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Belcarra -- 644 (PORT MOODY ratecentre)

Now these numbers don't mean much, but you can clearly see that if Fibernetics would want to represent the population and "spread" their footprint, there is not so much need for additional numbers in either North Vancouver nor West Vancouver. Expansion should include WHALLEY, NEWTON, LANGLEY, PORT COQUITLAM and HANEY ratecentres based solely on population numbers.

Just my two cents ... and I only live here!

[FONGO_mike]

Scanning the CNAC website, I see that Fibernetics has requested and been granted some more prefixes for BC ... unfortunately none of them are in NEW ratecentres, simply additional numbers for ratecentres that Fibernetics already has a presence in.

As noted previously:
778-775 & 778-776 -- Vancouver (adds to 604-283 & 778-300)
778-308 -- Richmond (adds to 778-803)
778-358 -- New Westminster (adds to 778-801)
778-382 -- North Vancouver (adds to 778-802)
778-508 -- West Vancouver (adds to 778-805)

Now I know that Fibernetics is "back-east" based (not "out-east" or "down-east"), but they are missing out on a large part of the population in Metro Vancouver. While it may seem like North & West Vancouver are part of Vancouver, they are actually separated by a large body of water and bridges, and are quite separate and distinct.

Here are some population facts (original link: http://www.metrovancouver.org/about/pub ... Trends.pdf)

Vancouver City -- 603,502 (VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Surrey -- 468,251 (WHALLEY, NEWTON, CLOVERDALE and some LANGLEY, FORT LANGLEY ratecentres)
Burnaby -- 223,218 (VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Richmond -- 190,473 (RICHMOND and some NEW WESTMINSTER ratecentre)
Coquitlam -- 126,456 (PORT COQUITLAM, PORT MOODY and some VANCOUVER, NEW WESTMINSTER ratecentres)
Delta -- 99,863 (LADNER, NEWTON, WHALLEY ratecentres)
Langley Township -- 104,177 (LANGLEY, FORT LANGLEY and some ALDERGROVE ratecentres)
North Vancouver Dist -- 84,412 (NORTH VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Maple Ridge -- 76,052 (HANEY ratecentre)
New Westminster -- 65,976 (NEW WESTMINSTER and some VANCOUVER ratecentres)
Port Coquitlam -- 56,342 (PORT COQUITLAM ratecentre)
North Vancouver City -- 48,196 (NORTH VANCOUVER ratecentre)
West Vancouver -- 42,694 (WEST VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Port Moody -- 32,975 (PORT MOODY, PORT COQUITLAM ratecentres)
Langley City -- 25,081 (LANGLEY ratecentre)
White Rock -- 19,339 (WHITE ROCK, NEWTON ratecentres)
Pitt Meadows -- 17,736 (HANEY ratecentre)
UBC/UEL Electoral Area 'A' -- 13,035 (VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Indian Reserves -- 8,094 (various ratecentres)
Bowen Island -- 3,402 (BOWEN ISLAND ratecentre)
Anmore -- 2,092 (PORT MOODY ratecentre)
Lions Bay -- 1,318 (WEST VANCOUVER ratecentre)
Belcarra -- 644 (PORT MOODY ratecentre)

Now these numbers don't mean much, but you can clearly see that if Fibernetics would want to represent the population and "spread" their footprint, there is not so much need for additional numbers in either North Vancouver nor West Vancouver. Expansion should include WHALLEY, NEWTON, LANGLEY, PORT COQUITLAM and HANEY ratecentres based solely on population numbers.

Just my two cents ... and I only live here!

Hey Hardy, it is a good point with the listing you posted about possible expansion. In the mean time, something that needs to be taken into consideration is that we are also trying to expand in other areas between Port Coquitlam and Halifax N.S.
Areas such as Winnepeg, Regina, etc, etc.

It is harder for us to focus on only expanding the boundary's where we currently already offer service. there are entire provinces where have not yet been able to make a "footprint" As we continue to grow, we will continue to grow at a faster pace (one of the reasons why i always suggest getting friends and relatives to also sign up)

We would lke to be able to focus more on that locations you mentioned, we are also taking into consideration other territory's with many factors being considered when we set up new DID's.

[TheHardy]

Wow Mike, you quoted the WHOLE thing!

Hey Hardy, it is a good point with the listing you posted about possible expansion. In the mean time, something that needs to be taken into consideration is that we are also trying to expand in other areas between Port Coquitlam and Halifax N.S.
Areas such as Winnepeg, Regina, etc, etc.

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly on that front. And more specifically, I wish that there would be a definitive answer (and reasoning) for the 'segmented' FREE (local) calling areas around some of the centres that currently (and potentially WILL) offer FREE calling --- Halifax, Winnipeg and many of the new ones; this has been flogged to death in other threads, so I am just quickly skimming over it here!

It is harder for us to focus on only expanding the boundary's where we currently already offer service. there are entire provinces where have not yet been able to make a "footprint" As we continue to grow, we will continue to grow at a faster pace (one of the reasons why i always suggest getting friends and relatives to also sign up)

Double edged sword -- from postings WAAY earlier by Kris, we have been given insight that it is harder to break into NEW markets to get DID's than those where there is already a presence (darn, can't find the post to reference it back now...). That being said, for the specific BC municipalities/cities that I mentioned, they are ALL within Metro Vancouver (where you already HAVE a presence...), just different ratecentres. While "technically" not increasing the FOOTPRINT of coverage (DID-wise), it covers more RATECENTRES and therefore gives the IMPRESSION of having more coverage (note all the overlapping coverage in Ontario ATM!).

As far as FOOTPRINT and POP's/DID's, I agree -- there are several PRIME candidates which would be IDEAL to get DID-coverage --- and I WOULD prioritize that over and above getting more ratecentre-penetration -- subject to the caveat above about ease of expansion into "virgin" territory.

We would lke to be able to focus more on that locations you mentioned, we are also taking into consideration other territory's with many factors being considered when we set up new DID's.

Fair enough. Like I say, I am just bringing forward ideas and suggestions. Again, based on the older premise presented by Kris about it being harder to break into new markets.

Thanks for taking the time to reply (and I am assuming FORWARD to the appropriate department). As per my previous offers, if anyone at Fibernetics/FPL/DV needs some more "local" insight into LIR's, LCA's etc out BC-way, feel free to have them give me a holler!

[Bloodsong]

as an FYI post, the following NPA-NXX's are considered Peterborough ...

[705] 201 243 270 304 312 313 403 536 559 740 741 742 743 745 748 749 750 755 760 761 768 772 775 808 813 868 872 874 875 876 926 927 930 931 933 957 977 991

My girlfriend and I have family in the Peterborough/Hastings/Lindsay area and have been patiently waiting for this area since I got FPL in '08.

What's surprising to me is that they don't push hard to be able to offer service in this market where there's a very high student population. As student populace tend to be large, vocal, and frequently renewed, they make an excellent vehicle for a growth market.

[TheHardy]

What's surprising to me is that they don't push hard to be able to offer service in this market where there's a very high student population. As student populace tend to be large, vocal, and frequently renewed, they make an excellent vehicle for a growth market.

That is a very valid point -- and most students also fall into the demographic range that I would think the advertisers that are co-branding with FONGO would find to be the most attractive. Hopefully someone in the "marketting department" is paying attention to this thread (or will have this forwarded to them by Steve... )

Remember too that call completion/termination is one of the other ways that Fongo generates revenue, so having a larger base of dialable numbers would seem to help out there too (but I guess that gets more into a Cost-Benefit-Analysis based on what the cost for expanding INTO an area would be...)

[FONGO_mike]

My girlfriend and I have family in the Peterborough/Hastings/Lindsay area and have been patiently waiting for this area since I got FPL in '08.

What's surprising to me is that they don't push hard to be able to offer service in this market where there's a very high student population. As student populace tend to be large, vocal, and frequently renewed, they make an excellent vehicle for a growth market.

A lot of students will take an umber from back home so as to allow friends and family to call them (by placing a local call) and then, simply by having a Fongo account, are able to call each other free of charge.

[TheHardy]

Just checking in to see if there is any movement at Fongo in regards to whether there will be any near-future DID expansion (Canadian specifically, or even some US if that is in the cards...).

"It is planned" etc with no specifics NOTWITHSTANDING ...

I'd like to know if there are concrete plans or any kind of a rollout timeline ... ??? I know nothing will likely be forthcoming other than "we are working on it" ... but I figure I have to ask anywho!

[liquorstore3]

+1 for Peterborough. I'd sign up right now if I could select a Peterborough number.

[liquorstore3]

Any idea if I can port a Peterborough number from Vonage to FPL even if the city is not included in FPLs free calling area? I assume I would have to pay the normal Canadian rate for calls within Peterborough, but would be able to call Toronto or Vancouver for free. Is that right? I use the phone so rarely that it would still be cheaper for me than Vonage.

[FONGO_steve]

Any idea if I can port a Peterborough number from Vonage to FPL even if the city is not included in FPLs free calling area? I assume I would have to pay the normal Canadian rate for calls within Peterborough, but would be able to call Toronto or Vancouver for free. Is that right? I use the phone so rarely that it would still be cheaper for me than Vonage.

Unfortunately at this time we also aren't able to port Peterborough numbers yet either.

[TheHardy]

Any idea if I can port a Peterborough number from Vonage to FPL even if the city is not included in FPLs free calling area? I assume I would have to pay the normal Canadian rate for calls within Peterborough, but would be able to call Toronto or Vancouver for free. Is that right? I use the phone so rarely that it would still be cheaper for me than Vonage.

At this time, as per Steve's post, Fongo is only able to port in #'s in cities where it currently offers DID's ... so if you cannot pick that city's # when signing up, you cannot port in (with very very very few exceptions around some larger metro areas).

You can always GET a Fongo account with a # "foreign" to you, use it for what you can, and hope that they will soon expand to cover your area (PB in this case...).

As Steve has replied, I am pretty sure that he has noted down P'Borough on the long list of desired DID's which is tacked up SOMEWHERE at Fongo HQ ....

[liquorstore3]

Thank you both for your replies. I'll consider signing up for a 'foreign' number but that's obviously not the most desirable solution.

[TheHardy]

Thank you both for your replies. I'll consider signing up for a 'foreign' number but that's obviously not the most desirable solution.

If you just stick with the softphone and don't buy the ATA config file, the cost to sign up for a "foreign" (undesirable) # is .... __FREE__ ... so you lose NOTHING. Then if PB comes online as a DID-city (IE: you can get a local # or port in one), then set up a new account!

TBH, we have been promised movement and expansion for quite some time, and there has been no action, all talk. Maybe now that summer is here? I dunno ... I really cannot say what Fongo is doing or planning, other than "we will take that under advisement" and "stay tuned for exciting expansion and improvement news" ... ... ... ...

[marcmale]

Really cool if
Rivière-du-Loup (418)862 and Rimouski was added. There's no city at east of Québec !!

[liquorstore3]

Hi all,
Just to let you know I've signed up with a competing service that does offer Peterborough DIDs. Fongo/DV/FPL lost my business by not providing service to my area. Although, I'm beginning to wonder if they do this purposely so that they can charge their major city clients for calling these locations.

[TheHardy]

Hi all,
Just to let you know I've signed up with a competing service that does offer Peterborough DIDs. Fongo/DV/FPL lost my business by not providing service to my area. Although, I'm beginning to wonder if they do this purposely so that they can charge their major city clients for calling these locations.

Sorry to hear that LS3 ... but at the end of the day, you have to do what you have to do that is best for YOU! I will be the first to admit that expansion is at a snail's pace here, but I believe that the product is solid. Unfortunately, it does not meet everyone's requirements, and there is still room for improvement.

Do you mind if I ask whom you went with and what your monthly charges are for your P'borough DID?

To be honest, one of the reasons that Fongo is slower to expand is that they get their OWN DID's rather than buying them from another carrier or thru a wholesaler, so their rate of expansion IS slower ... they do have to cover the up-front costs of "turning on" an NPA-NXX for the ratecentre that they wish to offer DIDs in, but they also control fully the entire 10,000 #'s --- which is what they want, and how their corporate structure is set up.

While it is also undeniable that they DO get revenue from having toll charges, being a "free-to-call" city is different than providing DID's in a city -- just look at all the expansion in the last 6 months which covered so many more cities, but no DID offering yet. There is an agreement in place with another carrier for the termination of those calls at this time, as Fongo (and it's parent Fibernetics) assess whether to expand into those areas and offer DID's.

Unfortunately, PB is in neither category at the moment.

Good luck with your service and I hope it all works out for you ...

[liquorstore3]

I ended up going with Voip.ms. I purchased an OBi100 and once I received it was able to set it up with a Peterborough DID and a UK DID. My setup will cost $5/month and I am anticipating an additional $5/month in usage.

I won't pretend that I understand the intricacies of offering a commercial voip solution. I'm sure there are a great many trade-offs and catch 22s when trying to provide a highly technical service such as this to the public. I'm sure FPL/DV/Fongo is a great voip provider. There are many people who swear by it and highly praise the service they receive. However the truth of the matter is that Voip.ms offered a service that suited my needs. FPL/DV/Fongo did not.

Thank you very much for taking the time to explain the issues to me. All the best.

[TheHardy]

Hey, glad to have helped! Paid-DID's have been suggested in the past, and that is why I can say that it is NOT the Fongo model for how they do things, as we did get that answer!

You are more than welcome for the answers and explanations that we were able to provide!

FPL is never a bad thing to have kicking around (as long as you use it once per 90 days!) as it is generally quite reliable; you can also use it for troubleshooting other things, or as a "throw-away" # to give out when signing up for things, so that you are not bothered on your real #s too often by telemarketers ... Shhh, but that is what one of my accounts is for!!! Just for signing up for things!