[resolved] Calls to 514-546-XXXX are not free any more

[andrew_bb]

Hello,

I used to call from my FPL number (514-316-XXXX) to my cell number (that is 514-546XXXX) for free. But today I discovered that calls to 514-546XXXX are not free any more. What has happened and why?

Regards
Andrew

[Jake]

It was either not supposed to be on the free list, of it is now missed off the free list. Either way it probably happened in the reshuffle lately.

Is the area you are calling on the free call list on their site? http://www.freephoneline.ca/cityListing

I looked the number up in their tables and it is showing a not free.

[TheHardy]

Hello,

I used to call from my FPL number (514-316-XXXX) to my cell number (that is 514-546XXXX) for free. But today I discovered that calls to 514-546XXXX are not free any more. What has happened and why?

Broken tariff -- I am PM'ing Steve and Kris on this (if they are still about!) as this is a MONTREAL ratecentre/exchange and SHOULD be free to call ... it obviously go broken by mistake in the latest round of updates!

I am sure that they will "fix" it ASAP, but with the holiday, who knows if that is soon!!

[andrew_bb]

Thanks TheHardy

[TheHardy]

Thanks TheHardy

Heyas, no problem at all -- this is kinda what I do. Ask any of the regulars, I am one of the constant pains-in-the-arses who is always finding BROKEN stuff. I know that Steve does not ignore me (although sometimes he must wish he would!) ... as I say, with the calendar being what it is, this particular NPA-NXX may not be fixed right away!!

In case it was not mentioned elsewhere (where you might have found it), one of the main resources we rely on for checking this stuff out (we being the amateurs here, not the FPL staff) is the site:
http://www.cnac.ca/data/ac819.htm (I just happen to have "area code" 819 open in another window, simply replace it with the one you need to check...)

as well as:
www.localcallingguide.com (to track down info on a ratecentre or see where it SHOULD be able to call, as a traditional landline).

Welcome to the gang of the INITIATED! Probably more info than you need ...

[FONGO_mike]

www.localcallingguide.com is a great resource to use in finding out where a number is from. In some cases though, a number may be listed as Montreal and still be long distance (outside our free calling zone) as not all numbers on the island are local to each other.

An example of this is calling from the west island to the east end. If you live in (as an example) Beaconsfield and try calling Riviere-des-Prairies it is a long distance call. Also, in certain cases, you may have your phone number assigned to your address but your provider will have the number based out of a center in another location that will cause what should be a local number turn into a long distance number.

[Jake]

http://www.localcallingguide.com is a great resource to use in finding out where a number is from. In some cases though, a number may be listed as Montreal and still be long distance (outside our free calling zone) as not all numbers on the island are local to each other.

An example of this is calling from the west island to the east end. If you live in (as an example) Beaconsfield and try calling Riviere-des-Prairies it is a long distance call. Also, in certain cases, you may have your phone number assigned to your address but your provider will have the number based out of a center in another location that will cause what should be a local number turn into a long distance number.

Hi Mike, first welcome to the forum!

This doesn't really effect me, but I am a little confused to if you are saying that 514-546-XXXX numbers are supposed to be free or not.

Looking at the calling guide 514-546-xxxx seems to be listed as being local to
438-238, 438-338, and 514-447.

I think I am right in saying that Fibernetics owns all of those numbers, so why is 514-546-XXXX not free?

[FONGO_mike]

Hi Jake,

First off, thank you for welcoming me!

If it is a number that we own, and in Montreal (as in a FPL number) then it should be free to call as all freephoneline to freephoneline calls should be free. The catch with this though is a lot of numbers will be listed as Montreal even though the number is registered in a certain area.

Before Montreal expanded the area codes (first the 450 and later the 438) it was common to be in the same area code and still have long distance charges apply on the call (as in west island to east end) With our numbers, only certain areas are covered. When you first sign up an account, and select your city (i will use Point-Claire for this example) numbers in that area are considered local and with-in our free calling zone. We do not however have any areas in the east end that we can offer and such those numbers are outside our zone at the moment.

There can always be an error however. If there is a number that you are calling that you believe is actually inside the free calling zone, then please let me or another freephoneline representative know and we would be more then happy to look into it.

[Jake]

Hi Jake,

First off, thank you for welcoming me!

If it is a number that we own, and in Montreal (as in a FPL number) then it should be free to call as all freephoneline to freephoneline calls should be free. The catch with this though is a lot of numbers will be listed as Montreal even though the number is registered in a certain area.

Before Montreal expanded the area codes (first the 450 and later the 438) it was common to be in the same area code and still have long distance charges apply on the call (as in west island to east end) With our numbers, only certain areas are covered. When you first sign up an account, and select your city (i will use Point-Claire for this example) numbers in that area are considered local and with-in our free calling zone. We do not however have any areas in the east end that we can offer and such those numbers are outside our zone at the moment.

There can always be an error however. If there is a number that you are calling that you believe is actually inside the free calling zone, then please let me or another freephoneline representative know and we would be more then happy to look into it.

Well I must be looking at things wrong then I'm not that fussed about it, as I mentioned it doesn't really effect me as I don't call there.

Maybe you site needs updating though, as on your page where it explains which cities you can call for free ( http://www.freephoneline.ca/cityListing ), Montreal is clearly listed there. If it isn't all of Montreal and just a sub section of it, then that should probably be explained as it could, and has, get confusing.

Keep up the good work on the forum, a strong FPL presence is always welcome!

[TheHardy]

http://www.localcallingguide.com is a great resource to use in finding out where a number is from. In some cases though, a number may be listed as Montreal and still be long distance (outside our free calling zone) as not all numbers on the island are local to each other.

An example of this is calling from the west island to the east end. If you live in (as an example) Beaconsfield and try calling Riviere-des-Prairies it is a long distance call. Also, in certain cases, you may have your phone number assigned to your address but your provider will have the number based out of a center in another location that will cause what should be a local number turn into a long distance number.

Information is based not only on LCG, but also from the CNAC website. I understand what you are saying about "Mtl-area" numbers, but the OFFICIAL CNAC designation of the RATECENTRE is Mtl ... not Mtl-ish, but "MONTREAL". As I say, I know WHERE you are coming from and I won't get into arguing semantics about it -- I fwd'd it to Kris & Steve (as I have done many times in cases like this...) and I am sure it will be dealt with.

FWIW, the actual "SWITCH" within the RATECENTRE does not matter for rates/routing, as it is broken down by RATECENTRE. I don't know what your tech-background or position within FPL is, so I won't start preaching anything, but I fully honestly believe that 514-546 needs to be kicked up to someone in Network/Rates&Routing/Tariff for closer examination!

(and also welcome, if I didn't get that in in my first reply)

[FONGO_mike]

Jake,

We certainly appreciate people helping out one another and i hope to help where i can.

Montreal is a little tricky on the break down of the city's/'burgh's since the island unification. Some of them are considered a sort of section of the city while others are considered their own individual city's. I am going to try and look further into this matter and see what i can do. I have a couple numbers to test and see if they should be in the free or not.

[TheHardy]

Jake,

We certainly appreciate people helping out one another and i hope to help where i can.

Montreal is a little tricky on the break down of the city's/'burgh's since the island unification. Some of them are considered a sort of section of the city while others are considered their own individual city's. I am going to try and look further into this matter and see what i can do. I have a couple numbers to test and see if they should be in the free or not.

Evening (again) Mike ... notice you are online replying as I reply ... WORD-FIGHT!

Using the CNAC CO Status page (http://www.cnac.ca/data/ac514.htm) we can find the actual RATECENTRES of Montreal, Lachine, Point Claire and others ...it does not BREAK DOWN into the actual SWITCHES that make up the various RATECENTRES, but for the purposes of billing etc, it is done on a RATECENTRE level anyways.

The traditional LCA (local calling area) for landline purposes (wireless/cellular has a LARGER LCA) found from www.localcallingguide.com (specifically http://www.localcallingguide.com/lca_ex ... xch=171610) is:
(note Montreal is NOT listed, as you can ALWAYS call locally within your OWN ratecentre!!)

Beauharnois, QC
Bedford, QC
Beloeil, QC
Boucherville, QC
Chambly, QC
Châteauguay, QC
Chomedey, QC
Clarenceville, QC
Contrecoeur, QC
Franklin Centre, QC
Hemmingford, QC
Howick, QC
Hudson, QC
Île-Perrot, QC
L'Épiphanie-L'Assomption, QC
Lachine, QC
Lachute, QC
Lacolle, QC
Laprairie, QC
Laval-Est, QC
Laval-Ouest, QC
Lavaltrie, QC
Le Gardeur, QC
Les Cèdres, QC
Longueuil, QC
Marieville, QC
Mascouche, QC
Mirabel-Aéroport, QC
Mirabel-Saint-Augustin, QC
Mirabel-Sainte-Scholastique, QC
Napierville, QC
Oka, QC
Pointe-Claire, QC
Pont-Viau, QC
Rawdon, QC
Rigaud, QC
Roxboro, QC
Saint-André Est, QC
Saint-Bruno, QC
Saint-Calixte-de-Kilkenny, QC
Saint-Chrysostome, QC
Saint-Constant, QC
Saint-Denis, QC
Saint-Eustache, QC
Saint-Hippolyte, QC
Saint-Jean, QC
Saint-Lambert, QC
Saint-Lin, QC
Saint-Marc, QC
Saint-Ours, QC
Saint-Rémi, QC
Saint-Sauveur, QC
Saint-Vincent-de-Paul, QC
Sainte-Anne-des-Plaines, QC
Sainte-Geneviève, QC
Sainte-Julie-de-Verchères, QC
Sainte-Julienne, QC
Sainte-Madeleine, QC
Sainte-Martine, QC
Sainte-Rose, QC
Sainte-Thérèse, QC
Shawbridge, QC
Terrebonne, QC
Varennes, QC
Vaudreuil, QC
Venise-en-Québec, QC
Verchères, QC


If you go to that page, and then click on *SEE LOCAL PREFIXES* you will get the information that should be correct for LCA in NPA-NXX format ...

[andrew_bb]

Very good information TheHardy! I learn a few new things because of this problem. Thanks again.

I just want to clarify the original problem because it looks like discussion went a bit off the main topic. The problem is specifically with 514-546-XXXX numbers. These numbers are listed as not free on the rate look up page of freephoneline.ca. However these numbers belongs to Montreal that is in the free calling area. This has nothing to do with calling between different boroughs in Montreal.

Regards,
Andrew

[FONGO_mike]

The problem is specifically with 514-546-XXXX numbers. These numbers are listed as not free on the rate look up page of freephoneline.ca. However these numbers belongs to Montreal that is in the free calling area. This has nothing to do with calling between different boroughs in Montreal.

Regards,
Andrew

I am now looking into this and i believe 514-546 will most likely be added. I can not guarantee it yet but will let you know as soon as i hear back.

[TheHardy]

Very good information TheHardy! I learn a few new things because of this problem. Thanks again.

I just want to clarify the original problem because it looks like discussion went a bit off the main topic. The problem is specifically with 514-546-XXXX numbers. These numbers are listed as not free on the rate look up page of freephoneline.ca. However these numbers belongs to Montreal that is in the free calling area. This has nothing to do with calling between different boroughs in Montreal.

Heya Andrew! Good to know we have enlightened you -- feel free to ask almost anything and I will be more than happy to share what I know!

Mike from FPL seems very eager to jump into the forums and help out, which is great! And he obviously knows who to forward stuff to as well. I have PM'd a bit with him as well and explained what I know of LCAs and Exchanges, Ratecentres and "cities" ... the terms get to be be rather confusing unless you know what they mean industry-wise. I am at a double disadvantage, as I am not an industry insider, nor do I know exactly how well Mike is versed in any of this too.

Within the RATECENTRE of Montreal, there will be several SWITCHES (which do not show in the CNAC list and only partially in the LCG) -- these are throughout Metro Montreal (but not in the outlying areas, such as Pt Claire etc). All calls within a specific RATECENTRE are _ALWAYS_ local, by the very definition of the Canadian telecom tariff (note LOCAL, not FREE). To the best of my knowledge, there is NO METERED service in Canada as there is in some places in the states.

By the time this all sorts out, I am 99.9% confident that 514-546 will be added as FREE and will have been an 'OOOPS' on the part of FPL. Keep a copy of your call logs if you were charged on this NPA-NXX and harass them for a refund of the amount once it is corrected.

[FONGO_mike]

Hi everyone,

It looks like the 514-546 and 514-316 issue is now resolved. If you are still experiencing issues with those numbers, please let me know.

[TheHardy]

Hi everyone,

It looks like the 514-546 and 514-316 issue is now resolved. If you are still experiencing issues with those numbers, please let me know.

RL tool shows both as $0.00, and seeing that _seems_ to be linked to the actual calling tariff, I can assume the above to be true! I don't call these numbers, so we shall wait on the OP (hey Andrew, thats YOU!) to confirm this!!

On a related note, Mike, did you "dig deeper" into the Montreal-ratecentre debate we were quasi-having? I think that if you check out the post that has all the local Montreal calling areas that a lot of the places that you mentioned have their own ratecentre names. As I expounded, I am not a Montrealer nor Islander, so I am not familiar with the INTIMATE details of the LCA of Montreal (nor do I claim to be) ... but I would be interested to learn if my assumption (and little bit of research) is correct, or if I am off the mark.

Thanks for digging into Andrew's problem and getting this looked after (assuming you pushed a little on this issue in Steve's absence and Kris's seeming absence!)

[Jake]

Hi everyone,

It looks like the 514-546 and 514-316 issue is now resolved. If you are still experiencing issues with those numbers, please let me know.

RL tool shows both as $0.00, and seeing that _seems_ to be linked to the actual calling tariff, I can assume the above to be true! I don't call these numbers, so we shall wait on the OP (hey Andrew, thats YOU!) to confirm this!!

On a related note, Mike, did you "dig deeper" into the Montreal-ratecentre debate we were quasi-having? I think that if you check out the post that has all the local Montreal calling areas that a lot of the places that you mentioned have their own ratecentre names. As I expounded, I am not a Montrealer nor Islander, so I am not familiar with the INTIMATE details of the LCA of Montreal (nor do I claim to be) ... but I would be interested to learn if my assumption (and little bit of research) is correct, or if I am off the mark.

Thanks for digging into Andrew's problem and getting this looked after (assuming you pushed a little on this issue in Steve's absence and Kris's seeming absence!)

The 'All Canada' list is still showing 1514546 as 2 cents. Maybe it takes a while for all the tariffs to line up with each other.

[FONGO_mike]

Hi everyone,

It looks like the 514-546 and 514-316 issue is now resolved. If you are still experiencing issues with those numbers, please let me know.

RL tool shows both as $0.00, and seeing that _seems_ to be linked to the actual calling tariff, I can assume the above to be true! I don't call these numbers, so we shall wait on the OP (hey Andrew, thats YOU!) to confirm this!!

On a related note, Mike, did you "dig deeper" into the Montreal-ratecentre debate we were quasi-having? I think that if you check out the post that has all the local Montreal calling areas that a lot of the places that you mentioned have their own ratecentre names. As I expounded, I am not a Montrealer nor Islander, so I am not familiar with the INTIMATE details of the LCA of Montreal (nor do I claim to be) ... but I would be interested to learn if my assumption (and little bit of research) is correct, or if I am off the mark.

Thanks for digging into Andrew's problem and getting this looked after (assuming you pushed a little on this issue in Steve's absence and Kris's seeming absence!)

The 'All Canada' list is still showing 1514546 as 2 cents. Maybe it takes a while for all the tariffs to line up with each other.

When i looked it up on our listings it showed it as being a free call. Where are you looking to see the pricing?

[TheHardy]

When i looked it up on our listings it showed it as being a free call. Where are you looking to see the pricing?

PM'd as well on this -- main Rate Look Up page ... scroll down to CANADA, and then SHOW COMPLETE LIST ....

http://www.freephoneline.ca/completeList?country=CANADA

If you then wait for it to load, search 1514546 it still shows $0.02 ....

I am guessing that the individual Rate Look Up is instantaneous tho...

[FONGO_mike]

I verified it by going to www.freephoneline.ca>products & services and the "click here" option on the long distance calling. I then used the rate look up tool (third box from the top) and entered the numbers. They both came up as $0.00 for me. If you are still experiencing issues with it, please let me know.

[TheHardy]

That is the correct -- that is the Rate Look Up tool (http://www.freephoneline.ca/ldServices#rl) ... and I get $0.00 (free) there too, as did Jake ...

Scroll down from there, to the Country list ... Find Canada ... look across to the right, click on SHOW COMPLETE LIST --- wait for the popup window to load ... then search 1514546 --- and the result there is $0.02 ... at least at the time of this posting, I just loaded and reverified (including doing a CTRL-R reload).

[andrew_bb]

Hi guys,

Sorry for late reply. I can confirm that the problem is resolved. I am able to make free calls to my 514-546-XXXX number. Thanks a lot to everyone who helped!

And Happy New Year!

Best Regards,
Andrew

[TheHardy]

Sorry for late reply. I can confirm that the problem is resolved. I am able to make free calls to my 514-546-XXXX number. Thanks a lot to everyone who helped!

No need to apologize! Glad we were able to help -- your problem created an interesting discourse between myself, Jake and newcomer MIKE from FPL, whom I think did most of the heavy-lifting in getting this issue resolved. Jake and I just fed him the ammo, he fired the gun ...

Keep in mind that similar situations may arise with new NPA-NXX's or if FPL increases their calling area ... so now you know how to get it resolved ... and posting it to the forum for the rest of us to take a kick at never hurts either!

If you need more info on anything, just kinda find the right thread and fire away! Always happy to jump in with my opinions and info!

<and you weren't late, just got resolved yesterday! Still pretty quick turn around for all involved due to the calendar!>

[FONGO_mike]

This may be just kicking a dead horse at this point, but is anyone still having any issues connecting calls in that area?